HomeGalleryFAQSearchRegisterLog inUsergroups

Welcome, Bienvenu, Benvenuto, Willkommen, Witamy, Добро пожаловать !



Share | 
 

 Caravaggio.

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
Go to page : Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
AuthorMessage
maryvonne



Posts : 62
Join date : 2010-08-17

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   8th April 2012, 10:12

j'écris en français, à vous de traduire chers amis, c'était très difficile pour Philippe qui effectivement était toujors dans les aigus , il nous a dit la veille ( à martine et moi) toutes ces difficultés mais il était content et fier de le chanter, je ne suis pas amatrice de musique contemporaine, mais j'ai bien accroché et je ne me suis pas ennuyée, le texte , l'histoire du Caravage tient en haleine, P. était excellent dans ce rôle très expressif et très acteur!!mais c'était épuisant pour lui il chantait tout le temps. les autres chanteurs: basse baryton ténor et soprano étaient excellents aussi notamment le baryton. je ne suis pas assez connaisseuse pour vous parler de la qualité de la musique mais mes oreilles n'ont pas souffert et je me suis trouvée bien dans cette ambiance de clair obscur, d'anges et démons, c'est un beau travail de Suzanne Giraud.
il y avait un choeur de l'opéra qui a chanté seul en début et en fin d'opéra
les duos , quatuors, alors çà change des duos baroques !!! le texte des chanteurs n'est pas le même donc parfois 5 textes différents, des dissonnances musicales ouh la la!!
je pense que la salle était mitigée il n'y a pas eu d'ovations comme lors des concerts de Philippe, quelques bravos, des applaudissements, certes mais pas d'enthousiasme vraiment, Suzanne Giraud a longuement étreint et félicité Philippe, il le méritait , voilà bonnes paques à tous, en conclusion, bon opéra mais pas tous les jours!!!
Back to top Go down
Astarto



Posts : 91
Join date : 2011-12-21
Location : France

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   8th April 2012, 12:32

Merci beaucoup pour cet reportage complet, Maryvonne! clapping

Translation of Maryvonne´s text:

"... It was very difficult for Philippe, who in effect was in the high register all through, the evening before he told us (Martine and me) all those difficulties, but he was content and proud to sing this, I am not a lover of contemporary music, but I was riveted and not bored at all, the text, the story of Caravaggio keeps one on tenterhooks, Philippe was excellent in this very expressive part with much acting! but it was exhausting for him, he sang the whole time. The other singers: bass, bariton, tenor and soprano were also very good, especially the bariton. I am not knowledgable enough to tell you about the quality of the music, but my ears did not suffer and I found myself well in this realm of chiaoroscura, of angels and demons, it is a beautiful work of Suzanne Giraud.
There was an opera choir which sang alone at the beginning and end of the opera.
The duos, quartets, now that was different from the baroque duets! The texts of the singers wasn´t the same, so at times 5 different texts, musical dissonances, oh my!
I believe that the audience differed, there weren´t such ovations as at the concerts of Philippe, some bravos, applause, of course, but no real enthusiasm, Suzanne Giraud has long embraced and thanked Philippe, he deserved it, so good easter to all of you, as a conclusion, good opera but not an everyday one!"

PhJ was singing the whole time? My, that must have been so tiring! All in all obviously M. Jaroussky, who seems to have carried this opera really, can be incredibly proud of himself. bow

Back to top Go down
SKNinHawaii



Posts : 62
Join date : 2010-03-05
Location : Mililani, Hawaii

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   8th April 2012, 19:26

Maryvonne: Merci beaucoup poucet reportage "Caravaggio" !


Astarto: Thank you for your excellent translation of Maryvonne's Caravaggio review. Now I can hear the music, Mr. Jaroussky's singing, see his expression and overall ambiance of the premiere. Looking forward to see some visual reportage also very soon. Don't you? At this very moment the second performance started in Metz. My heart and thoughts are with Mr. Jaroussky. Wishing him great success again.
Back to top Go down
Mercè



Posts : 129
Join date : 2010-04-09
Age : 71
Location : Barcelona (Catalonia)

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   8th April 2012, 20:32

Thanks, Rosamunda! I didn't know Anders Dahlin: what a beautiful voice!! And this song is marvellous.
Back to top Go down
SJuli



Posts : 282
Join date : 2010-05-29
Location : Budapest (Hungary)

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   8th April 2012, 20:59

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Back to top Go down
http://napijaroussky.wordpress.com/
Joanna



Posts : 330
Join date : 2010-02-26
Location : Poland

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   8th April 2012, 22:00

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Back to top Go down
Joanna



Posts : 330
Join date : 2010-02-26
Location : Poland

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   8th April 2012, 22:07

Maryvonne thank you for your review! and Astarto thank you for translation! give rose
Back to top Go down
Mercè



Posts : 129
Join date : 2010-04-09
Age : 71
Location : Barcelona (Catalonia)

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   9th April 2012, 09:24

Merci beaucoup, Maryvonne, pour votre résumé.

Pour nos oreilles, sensibles à la musique classique et, notamment, à la musique baroque, la contemporaine reste toujours... agaçante. Ça n'enlève pas de mérite à Suzanne Giraud et, bien sûr, à Jaroussky, dont la voix aura aidé, sans acun doute, à comprendre mieux cette musique.

Quand j'ai écouté pour la première fois les sonnets de Louise Labé avec la musique de Dalbavie je me suis sentie dépaysée, même mal à l’aise, mais, je les ai écoutés après maintes fois et maintenant je me demande si nous aurons un jour le CD.

Merci donc, encore une fois.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
Back to top Go down
Rosamunda



Posts : 322
Join date : 2010-09-15

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   9th April 2012, 12:48

Thanks Joanna for the link and for photography.
It is true that the Baroque composers composed their works, especially, to seduce the audience and to shine the qualities and the beauty of the voices of the performers.
Contemporary composers, no.
As I have no musical training or knowledge of Simon Corley and I'm just an average listener (but passionate, of course), I can not say any more. This type of contemporary music is not within my reach. no
Back to top Go down
carolineleiden



Posts : 327
Join date : 2011-09-29
Location : Holland

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   9th April 2012, 13:43

Many types of music often just needs some getting accustomed to. The same goes for baroque, if that is something unknown to the listener. Keep on trying, and with the familiarity will come the appreciation.

Well, with the exception of a-tonal music perhaps, the beauty of which somehow has eluded me to this day. smile (I can manage bi-tonal, though.)

Back to top Go down
rikkapijemy



Posts : 186
Join date : 2010-10-31
Age : 63
Location : belgium

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   9th April 2012, 14:27

The contemporary music is rather hermetic for the laymen.
I sometimes have the impression that it is about "exercises of laboratories" create by navel-gazing artists.
I often noticed that the listeners say that while interessant but not it is beautiful

Certainly, even the ignoramuses as me can become used as if to being affected, moved at once it is another story
But I spent a good time with Caravaggio and if a stage version was mounted, I would certainly see it
Back to top Go down
Rosamunda



Posts : 322
Join date : 2010-09-15

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   9th April 2012, 15:05

No, dear Caroline, I have tried many times and I can only make me irritated. I like many types of music, but there is a limit of my ability to perceive beauty. I think, as rikkapijemy, that contemporary music is written by and for musicians mostly.
And that's fine.
But I have yet to discover endless musical treasures that make me happy, without having to maintain a long and fruitless battle altogether.
I wanted to go to listen to Philippe in "Caravaggio", but not by Giraud or Fernandez, but despite them.
Back to top Go down
peacefulworld



Posts : 27
Join date : 2010-12-17
Location : Amsterdam

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   9th April 2012, 17:58

Becuase I did not understand French, it is difficult to comment.
However texts were on display and sentences were not always long. I could sometimes guess them.

The choir consists of 11 males and 11 females. There were 22 people in the orchestra.
The 750 seats of this oldest opera theater in France(1732) were 4/5 full.

I like it and I used a lot of energy to listen it because it was so intense.
Not only PJ, but also the other soloists and all the musicians were playing or singing so differently and concentrating enoumously.

At the end of part 4, I gave more attention to conductor but I could not follow him.
The tempo changed all the time. You don't know what notes will come next.
It is not predictable for me because I don't know modern music. That is why it is sometimes exciting.

All five solists were wonderful. There were so many a cappella parts which you can hear the voice of singers well.
PJ proved that he is not an angel, it was powerful in different way.

After the concert, I could talk to composer Giraud. I asked her why she chose Jaroussky? The answer was (you can easily guess) : "Because he is the best counter-tenor in the world." She was very kind and nice.

I talked to soprano Maria Wesseling and she said it was quite difficult and they could have only few rehearsals. But it was enjoyable with working with this team and she was satisfied with this opera.

And next came PJ. He said it was good that you came today. Second time went better than first one (Wesseling said that too) with a big smile. He looked also satisfied with this project.
It was an interesting experience and I admire all musicians who were there. It was really hard work for them. flowers
I would like to thank PJ to have this opportunity to listen modern music.

My husband wrote:
Modern music is not so easily accessible and it defies expectations sometimes.
But it has a lot to say after you get used to the difference in the musical frame.
It was an experience to see and hear the musicians work so hard to get the strong content across.

- - - information - -

Back side of this A3 poster which Joanna( [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] sent, there are details of program.

"Pourquoi un opera sur le Caravage?" this article you can read on
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Here she mentioned four paintings in this opera. Unfortunately they could not show those paintings at theater because it was too complicated to get official permission from the different musea.
1. Love conquers all
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

2.The rest on the Flight to Egypt. [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

3.The Luth Player.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

4.The musucions (or Le Concert.)
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Back to top Go down
agnesL



Posts : 10
Join date : 2011-06-23
Location : FRANCE - PARIS

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   9th April 2012, 18:37

Je rentre ce jour de Metz et voici mes premières impressions sur Caravaggio entendu ce dimanche de Pâques.
N'étant pas musicienne, j'ai remarqué que, bizarrement, la musique contemporaine sonne aussi bien à mes oreilles que la musique ancienne.
La scène du théâtre était presque entièrement occupée par un orchestre composé de percussions diverses, des cuivres, des instruments à vent, des cordes, un clavecin entouraient les cinq chanteurs, un peu serrés les uns contre les autres ; il n'y avait plus de place pour faire une quelconque mise en scène.
Un choeur de femmes et un choeur d'hommes ont pris place dans les balcons de chaque côté de la scène et ont répondu aux chanteurs à plusieurs reprises et notablement vers la fin de l'opéra.
La composition de Suzanne Giraud ne contient pas de ligne mélodique ; ce n'est pas une musique que l'on peut chanter dans sa salle de bains...
Par contre, la musique est saisissante, poignante, si bien que je me suis surprise en apnée, l'estomac noué, en train de tordre mon écharpe : un bon exercice de respiration pratiqué à temps a été salvateur !
Ecouter les sonorités des instruments "en direct", les notes assez sèches, l'ampleur si je puis dire des dissonances harmonieuses (pardon pour l'oxymore) fut une expérience que je n'oublierai pas. L'éclat, la puissance du clair-obscur est exprimé par des sonorités contrastées, l'éclat des cuivres et des percussions contrebalancé par la profondeur, la chaleur des cordes.
Le livret est minimaliste, je l'ai perçu comme un fil conducteur portant l'histoire du peintre illustrée par des dialogues avec ses partenaires protecteurs, modèles, amants...
Les voix chantent une sorte de récitatif en réponse aux instruments ; les cinq voix différentes couvrent presque toute la palette vocale et leur variété, leurs caractères très différenciés rendent vraiment vivants les différents personnages ; j'avais pris soin de relire au préalable le livre de Dominique Fernandez ce qui m'a aidée à entrer rapidement dans le sujet.
La voix de Philippe est sollicitée à l'extrême dans ce récitatif tendu, fébrile, violent, la diction y perdant parfois un peu de son intelligibilité mais le sous-titrage aide à saisir certains mots.
Philippe a dit que Suzanne Giraud "ne l'a pas ménagé" : en effet, il doit accompagner la puissance de l'orchestre, exprimer la violence des sentiments, des relations, la fébrilité et la détermination du désir de création du peintre, son désir aussi de se libérer des contraintes de ses commanditaires et de l'Eglise, ses impulsions destructrices et sa compassion pour l'humanité souffrante. Autant de contrastes que Philippe restitue au prix parfois de grand écart et d'audaces vocales pendant presque toute la durée de l'opéra (au moins 2 heures).
La salle n'était pas remplie, ce qui est normal pour un dimanche de Pâques mais j'ai eu l'impression que le public a été touché, ému par la capacité de la compositrice et des interprètes à rendre l'atmosphère de l'époque, ses tourments, l'angoisse du peintre dans sa "course à l'abîme" ; les spectateurs ont peut être été surpris mais ont, je pense reconnu le travail, la force d'imagination et de création.
Pour finir, j'ai été très heureuse d'assister à ce spectacle que je recommanderai à tous les curieux qui n'ont pas peur des émotions fortes.
PS : je n'ai pas vu de prise de son ni de camera ; je ne sais pas si le spectacle a au moins été enregistré en audio.
Agnès
Back to top Go down
agnesL



Posts : 10
Join date : 2011-06-23
Location : FRANCE - PARIS

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   9th April 2012, 18:41

I'll try to translate this text in english before the next week-end.
Agnès
Back to top Go down
Joanna



Posts : 330
Join date : 2010-02-26
Location : Poland

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   10th April 2012, 09:34

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Back to top Go down
Mercè



Posts : 129
Join date : 2010-04-09
Age : 71
Location : Barcelona (Catalonia)

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   10th April 2012, 10:19

Merci beaucopu, Agnès!

J'espère que'au moins un audio ait été enregistré.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
Back to top Go down
Joanna



Posts : 330
Join date : 2010-02-26
Location : Poland

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   10th April 2012, 18:13

La voix du Caravage

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Back to top Go down
agnesL



Posts : 10
Join date : 2011-06-23
Location : FRANCE - PARIS

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   10th April 2012, 20:56

Mercè wrote:
Merci beaucopu, Agnès!

J'espère que'au moins un audio ait été enregistré.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]


You're welcome, Mercè.
C'est avec plaisir !
Back to top Go down
Duffy



Posts : 473
Join date : 2011-01-31
Location : Germany

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   11th April 2012, 12:04

I'm back from France now, having seen the premiere on Good Friday.
We had seats in the 1st row, our knees in touch to the stage, could have easily untied the shoes of the violonists, those seats (1st category) mustn't have been sold at all. But that's another pair of shoes. Not the artists' business. There already was written a lot about the music, so I don't have to add anything concerning the opera in general.
We could hardly see Philippe at all without bowing. The same for the other artists. P sang almost all the time, LOUD, sharp, alarming and shocking but also sad and warm, soft, tender, moving, it was fascinating. There were four acts. At the end of the 2nd act, he killed his rival. Ended with a satanic, sung laughter, shivers down our spine. As if he had gone nuts at last. As I expected before, it was really great to see him work, it was tough. Glimpses flying between him and the conductor, lips moving while the others were singing. Concentrating and opening again, acting, almost seeming to cry, far beyond anything I heard of him before. Exhausted when it was over. Me too. But no one can call him boyish or androgyn anymore, the angel wings are gone. Great artist.
Anders Dahlin also was very convicting. Mischievious, slyly acting. Sung very beautiful. The others didn't "get" me......To my mind, they did a job, no passion, no acting. I think I won't get used to that kind of contemporary music, but I'd like to see Caravaggio again, to see if my impressions change.
After the intermission, we could change to other seats, now we were able to see a bit more. When it was over, ovations, a few bravos for the artists and Mme Giraud. I left my chocolate Easter rabbit at the stage entrance and I hope he got it. Everyone was in need of chocolate after the event I suppose prankster

Pilar,
nice that we met, why didn't we spend the evening together? Next time.... flowers


Last edited by Duffy on 13th April 2012, 14:53; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : typo)
Back to top Go down
Rosamunda



Posts : 322
Join date : 2010-09-15

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   11th April 2012, 13:47

Dear Duffy, many, thank you very much for your opinion.
But my curiosity, really you observed angel wings on the Nero of "L'incoronazione"?
I went completely unnoticed. Cool
Since I could not go to Metz ¿Felipe singing all the time his upper register? As in Nero?
Back to top Go down
agnesL



Posts : 10
Join date : 2011-06-23
Location : FRANCE - PARIS

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   11th April 2012, 16:09

I have got some informations from PJ's theatrical agent : about Caravaggio, there was only a record to make an archive.
About Louise Labe poems, sung by PJ a few years ago, no CD planned for the moment.
It's agreat pity !
Agnès
Back to top Go down
Pilarddcc



Posts : 662
Join date : 2011-11-28
Age : 38
Location : Spain

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   11th April 2012, 21:35

Dear all,

I'm finally back from trip to Metz. Since there a lot of great reviews about Caravaggio I will skip the detailed version of my own impressions. I am sorry to disagree with all but I actually didn't like the opera. I can't provide a musicological argumentation about the Mme. Giraud's work but I can say that the libretto was horrible. I wouldn't expected something much better since Fernandez's book is quite boring and dissapointing. He actually researched a lot about Rome at the Seicento but his point of view is quite biased and the most important thing it is not an addictive reading, so it fails as a novel. I wouldn't have expected anything from a second-class writer but Fernandez is not a ignorant, so I am shocked about how dull was the libretto.

The music was very hard and it seemed that the composer wanted to show us a full catalogue of instruments and the full range of techniques you can think of, I didn't enjoy the result. The scenae was pretty busy, plenty of musiciens and singers, it was clear from the beginning that everyone was a little bit in tension with the effort. I feel pity for the conductor, he had to study this whole heavy opera!

Regarding the singers. I agree with Duffy, only Philippe and Anders Dahlin were really into it. They interacted and tried to show their feelings along the opera, while the others were correct and perfectly good but they didn't reach the same level of dramatism. Philippe was as professional as always reverence and once again he showed everyone what kind of artist he is. I felt worried about the waste of his talent, I'm sorry but I think it is a great waste. He has an amazing voice and it is a fragile instrument and this opera was such ademanding job for him! However he was magnificient! clapping

The theatre was full but, at least on Friday, it was clear that people weren't into it, there were clapping and exactly one "bravo" a lady behind me, maybe the composer's mother?? wink I clapped a lot, even if I didn't feel like it, I support Philippe's choice to get involved into contemporary music but I must confess I'll keep listening to classical one!!
Back to top Go down
Pilarddcc



Posts : 662
Join date : 2011-11-28
Age : 38
Location : Spain

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   11th April 2012, 23:54

Duffy: It was great meeting you too! It's a pity, I would have loved to have something together but since you were with a friend I didn't want to impose myself! flowers
Back to top Go down
Joanna



Posts : 330
Join date : 2010-02-26
Location : Poland

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   12th April 2012, 09:44

'Caravaggio : un oratorio profane plus qu’un opéra'
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

La critique de Pierre Rigaudière (Diapason)
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Back to top Go down
carolineleiden



Posts : 327
Join date : 2011-09-29
Location : Holland

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   12th April 2012, 10:15

When "Le Sacre du Printemps" premiered In Paris one hundred years ago, the music and the ballet were both so new, so strange, so unorthodox that riots and fights broke out in the theatre. People left during the show, women fainted, men exchanged vulgarities and punches, stuff was thrown on the stage, and the ones who did want to listen couldn't half the time because the music was outboo-ed by the ones who did not like it. It was total chaos.

The Sacre proved to be a masterpiece. It was just too different from what people were used to back then. Musically, as the human race, we evolve. A few hundred years ago there were harmonies that were considered just too dissonant, that are completely accepted today.

I really feel bad about missing this. Anything this controversial must have been really interesting.

Back to top Go down
Pilarddcc



Posts : 662
Join date : 2011-11-28
Age : 38
Location : Spain

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   12th April 2012, 10:20

The problem with modern operas, as with modern requiems relies in the fact that they don't longer answer the needs of the society. It's the same problem with religious art! It's not about being controversial or too much new, it's about the very essence of art.
Back to top Go down
carolineleiden



Posts : 327
Join date : 2011-09-29
Location : Holland

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   12th April 2012, 10:35

Sometimes, things that were radically different can only be appreciated with the advantages of hindsight. Maybe, just maybe... in twenty years time the people being there last Easter might think: as a whole I hated it then, but there were some moments that actually were quite daring and that helped things move along and improved music.

I am SOOO curious about what it sounded like. Nothing on YT yet...
Back to top Go down
maryvonne



Posts : 62
Join date : 2010-08-17

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   12th April 2012, 10:41

pilarddcc: perhaps it was me behind you on friday, i clapped and i said bravo, i was near Suzanne Giraud, the composer clapping
Back to top Go down
Pilarddcc



Posts : 662
Join date : 2011-11-28
Age : 38
Location : Spain

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   12th April 2012, 11:46

Maryvonne: So I get you're not her mom's... [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

My opinion is only that: my opinion! But I must say that being radically different is not always the sign of a genius. Caravaggio himself was quite controversial but his works were considered master pieces at his time and the same can be said about the great masters. Just a few were unoticed by their contemporaries. Good things are always good things no matter the epoch, but keeping the idea that contemporary artists are genius misunderstood by their ignorant peers is a great excuse for them.
Back to top Go down
carolineleiden



Posts : 327
Join date : 2011-09-29
Location : Holland

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   12th April 2012, 12:03

Pilar, I agree with you! Being different does not automatically equal being better. But every now and then, something interesting happens. And everything that is old now, was new once. It is how we develop, so it is important not to make something different automatically equal with being something bad either...

Well, you were there and I was not, and I cannot judge for myself. I will have to wait what history will have to say about all this when I am old and grey. Rats....
Back to top Go down
Rosamunda



Posts : 322
Join date : 2010-09-15

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   12th April 2012, 14:08

Since I could not go to Metz, I can not speak with knowledge, but I tend to think like Duffy and Pilar.
I am a average listener, I do not know the techniques of music, nor am I a student of the styles and trends. The music that interests me go through my sensibility, my own, I do not care what others think of a more abstract and can capture the conceptual structure or mathematics of music ..
I care about that music, like any other art, but more than any other art, that moves me, shakes me, makes me ecstatic that divides my heart and then reset again, I exalt or causes me unspeakable pain, I do mourn or make me cry with joy. The rest do not quite understand.
The lack of harmony, sounds that do not touch or a fiber of my soul and orchestral heavy blows that break the eardrums, the lack of total harmonic line, winding roads or minimalist instrumental with no apparent purpose, the cruel treatment of the wonderful voices are forced to lose their color by dint of shouting, all these things slip on me (at best) or assaulted me before I could do more to resist the crossfire of which I am the victim, and ended up physically and mentally irritated.
I do not care to witness first hand something that only my descendants will understand, if it has not reached a total oblivion.
I like Western music (sorry, another handicap) from the Middle Ages to the twenty-first century, but not all of them all, then or now. And between these two extremes are very rich period of creativity and genius wonderful, and periods of very poor, very poor, elapses time elapsing.
In the case of Caravaggio, I do not think Philippe is a privileged because a composer has dedicated his work inspired by her voice, I think that the privilege has been to Giraud, because Philippe has premiered one of his works.
Back to top Go down
Pilarddcc



Posts : 662
Join date : 2011-11-28
Age : 38
Location : Spain

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   12th April 2012, 15:06

agree

Yes, Rosamunda, the lucky ones were Giraud and Fernandez, they had the privilege of having Philippe's talent for their work!
Back to top Go down
rikkapijemy



Posts : 186
Join date : 2010-10-31
Age : 63
Location : belgium

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   12th April 2012, 17:27

Dear Carolineleide
To continue your démonstartion about the Sacre du Printemps, I shall take as example the musics of certain current movies which are only dissonance and which however do not strike most of people
Having assisted the version concert of Caravaggio I think more and more that a scenic version would focus us less on the music which would find its just place in the whole of the work
Back to top Go down
Pilarddcc



Posts : 662
Join date : 2011-11-28
Age : 38
Location : Spain

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   12th April 2012, 17:35


So let's focus on the libretto, what's your opinion about it? For me it was the worst part of the opera, sometimes meaningless and sometimes simply empty!
Back to top Go down
rikkapijemy



Posts : 186
Join date : 2010-10-31
Age : 63
Location : belgium

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   12th April 2012, 19:15

I spent a good moment by reading this book maybe because I took advantage of it to deepen(fathom) my knowledge on the works of the painter.
It is especially true for the first part because later I didn't feel the tension for which we were entitled to wait in " a running in the abyss..." Maybe the title is a little bit ambitious?
I better felt this oppression in the opera. Obviously if the book didn't please you, the notebook cannot enthuse you
Back to top Go down
Joanna



Posts : 330
Join date : 2010-02-26
Location : Poland

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   13th April 2012, 10:40

Spoiler:
 

METZ : CARAVAGGIO, À LA DÉCOUVERTE DU BAROQUE SPECTRAL
* *
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Back to top Go down
Rosamunda



Posts : 322
Join date : 2010-09-15

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   13th April 2012, 12:45

Pilar:
A critic who reveals the banality of the libretto and doubts about whether it could withstand a staging!.
There is some truth in this view, right?.
The worst part for me is that Giraud, who has written this opera by and for the voice of Philippe (the wonderful, wonderfull voice of Philippe), has been limited so far as to take their chances of shrill cries, regardless of its beauty and the risks it faces. I do not understand.
"The French national countertenor" for his talent deserves a genius composer, not a "spectral". I think. think
Back to top Go down
Pilarddcc



Posts : 662
Join date : 2011-11-28
Age : 38
Location : Spain

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   13th April 2012, 13:43

Thanks Joanna for the review and the picture!

Rosamunda: As I said before the libretto was the weakest aprt of the opera and it was a pity, especially because Carvaggio's life is quite interesting!
Back to top Go down
Duffy



Posts : 473
Join date : 2011-01-31
Location : Germany

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   13th April 2012, 14:46

After a week's interval I already regret not having stayed in Metz in order to see it a second time. The music is a matter of taste and, as far as I'm concerned. musical education. During the intermission I heard a lady say : "Il faut grandir avec cette musique" That's maybe all ? I don't think the music itself was a physical threat to the voice, it only was very uncommon. I think the challenge was the length of it all and the difficulties of the opera itself, not the notes, Nerone may have been harder in that aspect..... In the meantime some very beautiful moments "popped up" in my mind in a way, e.g. the scene when Caravaggio sings about "L'amour vainqueur", or the scene after Anna's death, extremely beautiful. kiss
Thinking about the libretto, dear Pilar, there are coming a few comic elements to my mind, I must admit. At the beginning, Caravaggio, describing a fight, "et pif et paf et pouf" We smiled at each other, "Les aventures de Tintin" !!! And there also was a part which could have been taken out of an old american western movie "The wings. Take the wings! There you are! You were calling for that, idiot!". I admire P even more for having sung or spoken that text without a grin. Another: Towards the end, on the beach (I hope I remember it correctly)
"Cecco, I'm sick, please go and get the paintings and then we return to Rome together! (A sailor had kept the paintings by order of the captain, pretending Caravaggio hadn't paid enough for the passage) Cecco: "To be your slave again? I was the sailor!" As if the author would have looked on his watch, discovering that the story must come to an end now...I didn't read the novel before, but I think a novel and a libretto (or screenplay) take different techniques. There was no thread running through the libretto. think wise
But after all, if they should do it again, I would be there, even if he sang some pages of the population register. He'd do it great. party
Back to top Go down
rikkapijemy



Posts : 186
Join date : 2010-10-31
Age : 63
Location : belgium

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   13th April 2012, 15:09

I completely agree with you, Duffy.
That why I would like to see a scenic version
Back to top Go down
Pilarddcc



Posts : 662
Join date : 2011-11-28
Age : 38
Location : Spain

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   13th April 2012, 15:10

Dear Duffy! I completely forgot about "pif et paf et pouf", It was hard to me not to start laughing [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
Back to top Go down
Rosamunda



Posts : 322
Join date : 2010-09-15

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   13th April 2012, 18:46

Ah! It's here again!
Dear Duffy, rikkapijemiy etc: This is the inevitable "Philippe effect"! inlove
No matter what you sing, you always need more.
But that's only for Philippe´s excellence, neither the composer nor the librettist.
C'est la vie!
Back to top Go down
Carol Ina



Posts : 18
Join date : 2012-02-19
Age : 44

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   13th April 2012, 18:51

Duffy wrote:
I would be there, even if he sang some pages of the population register. He'd do it great. party

Dear Duffy,

I had to laugh about this, but I totally agree with you, he is 'just' great, as simple as that, whatever he sings it becomes special!

Back to top Go down
Astarto



Posts : 91
Join date : 2011-12-21
Location : France

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   13th April 2012, 19:37

Well, I think it´s a great pity if a libretto is in parts meaningless or empty, or simply badly written. How can a performing artist derive meaning from a boring and uninspiring text? (Or a composer, by the way.) But as we know, PhJ is such a great performing artist and actor that, indeed, he would be able to move an audience to tears with reading from the population register. (Which has a lot to do with the fact that he is such a HUMAN human being.)
Well, but baroque composers worked with quite boring libretti, too. But with horror do I remember our reading the text of "Freischuetz" written bei Wagner himself, at (German) school. We were lying on the floor howling with laughter about how incredibly bad his text is!! I never learned to enjoy the opera after that...

A review of the opera "Caravaggio" mentioned "quarter tones". Is it true that the composition contained those? If it did, I can only admire the singers who handled those. It must be so difficult.

Back to top Go down
agnesL



Posts : 10
Join date : 2011-06-23
Location : FRANCE - PARIS

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   13th April 2012, 22:12

As promised, I finally made a shortened (and imperfect) english version of my own feelings about "Caravaggio".
Il did'nt study music, so, I don't see any difficulty about contemporary music as well as early music.
In Metz, the stage was almost full with the musicians and instruments, string instruments, wind instruments and many percussions ; the five singers were huddled together in a free corner.
So, it seems to me that there was no more place to stage this opera in any way.
Two chorus, one made up of men and another made up of women, were setting up in the circle on either side of the stage.The chorus responded to the singers on several occasions during the opera and some of these moments were significantly emotional for the listeners.
There is no melody in the music of "Caravaggio" ; you can't sing it in your bathroom...
However, it's very powerful, sometimes violent, sometimes loving, so to illustrate the temperament of the artist and the contrast of this paintings.
The five voices cover almost the whole range, with total involvement to make living characters, so that the staging was not necessary.
PJ obviously hard concentrating, had to sing during almost all the time, to do "vocal splits" always successfully ; I think it was very difficult for him to sing under a such vocal stress, however he is able to keep the delicacy of his expression.
I found the libretto "minimalist", just an unifying threat, but the extremely talented singers help us to forget it.
At the end, the listeners were probably surprised but they applauded the work and the performance.
As for me, I was very happy to discover this opera with such strong feelings.
Back to top Go down
tuffy942



Posts : 207
Join date : 2009-12-08
Location : miami and chile

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   14th April 2012, 14:19

Thank you all for a most interesting reaction to this evenT!!! I could relate to many, especially Pilarddcc, about this kind of music...I myself do not like or understand most modern compositions and so would not have enjoyed, but I applaud Philippe's adventuresome spirit and being so brave for taking risks . bravo! I believe a lot of you went also to show support and love for our Felipito, so my bravo! go to you guys too!!
I do fear for the health of his voice also, since taking risks in this sense is a little dangerous. But I suppose he is the best judge of this.

Thank you once more, Duffy, Pilarddcc, rikkapijemy,agnesI. Astarto, Carol Ina and Joanna, (lovely picture!)and Rosamunda with her inspired comments....Giraud should be bowing bow to PJ for his courage in undertaking her work!! stars stars
Back to top Go down
rikkapijemy



Posts : 186
Join date : 2010-10-31
Age : 63
Location : belgium

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   14th April 2012, 22:45

"Philippe Jaroussky incarne un Caravage à la fois génie et mauvais garçon, et trouve là de nouvelles couleurs inouïes."
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Back to top Go down
Astarto



Posts : 91
Join date : 2011-12-21
Location : France

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   15th April 2012, 12:41

and later in the text:

"... Philippe Jaroussky qui, dans le rôle-titre, trouve ici un magnifique emploi.
Avec une réelle gourmandise des mots de la langue française, le contre-ténor brosse le portrait d'un personnage profondément libertaire et indiscipliné, aux antipodes de l’angélisme souvent associé à sa vocalité dans le répertoire baroque."

– Bravo!

Back to top Go down
Rosamunda



Posts : 322
Join date : 2010-09-15

PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   15th April 2012, 15:25

Well, let us quote the critics:

"On sera moins clément avec le livret de Dominique Fernandez, souvent confus dans sa narrativité, parfois ridicule dans la trivialité de certaines répliques, et dans l’ensemble assez maladroitement adapté de son beau roman La Course à l’abîme." (Pierre Degott)

and later:

"Enfin, Philipe Jaroussky se jette à corps perdu dans le rôle du peintre maudit, dont il parvient à faire ressortir toutes les ambiguïtés. Entre l’ange et la bête, c’est évidemment le premier qui domine, car le « mauvais garçon » ne sera jamais, malgré tous ses efforts, l’emploi naturel de notre contreténor national… Ce dernier n’en affronte pas moins avec hardiesse une partie écrite sur mesure, mais qui expose néanmoins sans complaisance les fragilités de son instrument. Un grand bravo pour cette redoutable prise de risque ! " (Pierre Degott)

I do not understand the purpose of making Philippe is playing a "mauvais garcon" full cry, without harmony, without nuance, almost no music. He has ability to do what he wants, but has at its disposal a vast field of "bad guys" and "good guys" written by Handel, Monteverdi and many other geniuses who, besides drawing the character wonderfully, they do sing.

And another critic:

"Le timbre est intact, donc point falsifié, à l’exception de ses montées brutales aux aigus, d’une projection plus sèche et tranchée et en rapport à ce que l’on pourrait appeler le baroque spectral. Un challenge qu’il remporta de haute lutte. La distribution tout entière fut à la hauteur de l’enjeu. "(Georges Masson)

¿Montées brutales aux aïgus?. And that's not a brutal cry?

Bravo, dear Philippe!. All I can say is small. He has done a work for Titan, with the soul and body and still admire him more for this. But they have made him take unnecessary risks, without taking into account the delicate beauty of her voice.
Philippe's voice is a treasure, and it hurts my soul when I realize the effort and talent that has been expended to save an opera that does not deserve.

If it was not Philippe the protagonist, you would think the same of this opera?.
For my part I have to confess that were it not that Caravaggio is Felipe, I would be indifferent to everything related to this work.
Back to top Go down
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: Caravaggio.   Today at 22:21

Back to top Go down
 
Caravaggio.
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 3 of 4Go to page : Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 Similar topics
-
» Caravaggio

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
 :: Opera!!!-
Jump to: